[kullukid]

Here's a great link to some well known & lesser known works on Advaita.

http://www.advaita.o...atmananda_notes

The rest of this website is also worth checking out for any serious Advaita enquirers. Especially the section called"The teaching of Sri Atmananda Krishna Menon"  

http://www.advaita.o.../atmananda1.htm

http://www.advaita.org.uk/index.htm

[batistuta]

KK,  A very good Link and I was surprised to find 'self Knowledge and Self Realisation' by Maharaj. The tone of the teachings is so oriented towards Bhakthi that I am not sure if I am reading the same Teacher of 'I AM That. I could help but draw   parallels between this book and Sri Adishankara charya's Bhaja govindam, which was also  quite contrary to his teachings.

Edited by batistuta, 24 September 2007 - 04:51 PM.

[kullukid]

Sorry Bati, but i couldn't find 'self Knowledge and Self Realisation' by Maharaj. Can you provide the link to the page please?

Here's another great link to some Neo Advaitist writers. I particularly like the Galen Sharp page .......very clear!

http://www.sentient....alen-sharp.html          
KK

[batistuta]

KK, Once we go to the Home Page of the website, advaita.org, on the left-hand corner of the page, there are a few  Hyper Links to Masters like Ram Tzu and Maharaj. Once we enter Maharaj's Page,  one can find Self-knowledge and Self Realisation link there.

KK, Great link about Galen Sharp. ' I am not the doer' is something which Is not easy for me   to understand. In Theory yes, But once the same teaching is applied in practical terms, it has so many connotations ( No one is responsible for anything, or Maybe I have mis-interpreted it?). I can understand that our actions are conditioned, based on our Up-bringing, the events that Unfold, etc.., but  if I extend the same argument to Tyrants, Murderers..... etc, it is tougher to accept it. In all the atrocities that were commited against Humanity, I tend to think that the Tyrants always had a different Option.

Eckhart, Maharaj and Ramesh Balsekar all expound the same concept of ' you are not the doer' in different terms. But once I Realise that I am not the body, but the being, and all senitent beings are a part of me , would that mean that I would refrain from harming others in every way? . Does this not give on licence to go out and do what they want, as they are not the doer ? I think I have mis-understood the teaching.

KK, Can you please provide the correct interpretation?

Thanks.

Edited by batistuta, 25 September 2007 - 05:50 PM.

[kullukid]

KK, Can you please provide the correct interpretation?

Thanks.
[/quote]

Hi Bati, not sure i can explain it as well as Galen Sharp or Sri Atmanandaji, but i'll try, forgive me if i become slightly repetitive, but explaining the unexplainable is no easy task.

I'm sure you will have come across Sri Nisargadatta & J.K. saying "The Seeker is the Sought" what this means is that we (the mind) are looking for some form of freedom or escape from our current illusive state of seperate (limited) self, (which according to Buddha is trapped in misery & suffering in the cycle of Death & Re-birth) to a re-emergence with the Absolute (unlimited) Self (Nirvana). We are under the illusion that the only way we can achieve this is by knowing or arriving at THE TRUTH through thinking. Unfortunately we are conditioned to think by making concepts, in  fact the very thought "ME" is a concept which has divided its self into subject-object/observer-observed which then creates further concepts, all concepts are limited. So a limited conception in the mind is trying to conceive an Absolute consciousness that is unlimited.

So what mind or the seperate (limited) self as done, is created an illusive Phantom self (The Doer) that does not really exist. Really there is only Absolute (unlimited) Consciousness which is Truth Consciousness Bliss or SAT CHIT ANAND & really I AM THAT there is no seperate self or doer.

There is just Seeing, no seer no seen. just Doing, no doer no done. Just Observing, no observer no observed etc etc.

IMHO, the essence of JK's teaching is that we have to come to a realisation (which is not understanding through conceptual thought) that we are caught in an apparent trap/cage of our own making, but not only are we caught in the trap but we are the trap or cage, which is created by our seperate self or divisive mind which imagines it can think it's way out of the cage by further learning, gathering of knowledge & understanding based on our constant conceptualising. Unfortunately all the very act of thinking through faulty concepts due to incomplete knowledge does is strengthen the false self (EGO)so in affect we are the content & the structure of the self made cage,there is NO ME to be freed, no seperate Thinker that can think it's way out or escape by becoming Pure or Good.
So through conditioning we  believe that we are seperate entities (limited minds) living seperate lives within Consciousness, whereas in fact we are that Absolute Consciousness (unlimited mind), so how can we ever perceive or cognize this through conceptual thought? JK says "We are like a dog chasing it's tail!"

JK's answer to this is the SEEING through Choiceless awareness. When we look in this way without prejudice or judgement we SEE "What Is" without further adding to the limited self, in other words we do not add more concepts to the limited self, we just percieve, that very perceiving is what we are; Absolute Consciousness;without a second. This Absolute Consciousness is the Unknowable Truth & this is why J.K. is constantly saying you cannot  "Do It" Truth transcends  "The Known" & besides who is going to do it? The illusive non existent phantom doer? So through this SEEING I comes to the realisation that I AM THAT;  TRUTH! & the seperate doer is not. This is the psychological revolution that J.K. is constantly referring to.

So if all the Great Masters of the past such as Jesus, Buddha, Ramanaji have come to this Self Realisation that I AM TRUTH then they no longer operate from the dual limited False self, but have become merged in ( At One with) & operate from TRUTH (Absolute Consciousness) in fact you could say they are operating from Unlimited Consciousness. So along comes us (illusive,limited self consciousness) we read about these great saints lives & sayings & the various what seem to us like miracles that they have performed & we want to know how to "DO IT" how to understand through gathering knowledge, we try to know the Unknowable Truth, when really we are THAT TRUTH! Some sages refer to it as LOVE!

So finally getting back to your original question. Don't you think that anyone who's come to this realisation & who are abiding in I AM TRUTH or I AM LOVE would refrain from harming others in every way?

The tyrants & murderers that you mention are still acting from the confused limited illusion of seperate self just like the rest of us. Their actions seem to be more severe or extreme than our own, but remember we are judging them through our limited knowledge that we have made into a false self, we don't SEE the full picture or know their past circumstances or experiences of life that have lead them to their present state. We do not SEE the TRUTH maybe this is why J.C. said "Judge Ye Not Lest Ye Be Judged Thyself" Everyone's concept of right & wrong varies subject to our past experiences, for example i'm a meat eater & i know we have members who are vegetarian's. So let's say that one of these tyrants steals some meat from a butcher & sells it to me, i cook it & eat it. In the eyes of a vegetarian i may have committed a worse crime than the theif.It is all relative, because we only see things through relative truth not the Absolute Truth, which we Truly are. Absolute Consciousness (Your True Self) which IS  perceiving cannot be perceived.

The link i sent you to Sri Atmananda's Teachings explains this much better than my seperate self can!
This is the relevant chapter [url="http://www.advaita.org.uk/discourses/atmananda/atmananda4b.htm"]http://www.advaita.org.uk/discourses/atman...atmananda4b.htm[/url]
But really you need to start at chapter1 to fully appreciate it. [url="http://www.advaita.org.uk/discourses/atmananda/atmananda1.htm"]http://www.advaita.org.uk/discourses/atman.../atmananda1.htm[/url]
I hope my seperate self confusion does not confuse you more!   KK

[batistuta]

Hi KK, Thanks for the Lucid explanation. I am looking at Jesus comment ' judge not lest you be judged in a different Light' after reading your post. I was also confused on  what J.k. meant by ' seeker is the sought' statement, that is also cleared now. I am reading the teachings of Atmananda ( 2nd Chapter) and No, you have not added to my confusion, , but helping me understand these things better.

KK, How do we go about SEEING through Choiceless awareness. Here I am , I can observe my thoughts, I can see that I am not my thought, I am the witness to the thought. Do I constanly get Back to this state of witnessing? Is this the way for Choiceless awareness? In this way, ' I am not the body' would be reinforced, then let things happen as they do?

What would be the fundamental step for any sadhaka?

Thanks,

  Bati.

[kullukid]

I'll try to reply in detail when i have a bit more time......meanwhile these links may answer your question. Go to the following pages in the order i have shown them without jumping to other pages on the sites & it should explain what you are asking. KK

http://www.jkrishnam...g_in_the_bus#dq

http://www.deeshan.c...rishnamurti.htm

http://www.jkrishnam...lessAwareness_4

http://www.jkrishnam...d_Chapter11.pdf

http://www.jkrishnam...Awareness_4.pdf

http://www.kfionline...sethings/22.asp

Edited by kullukid, 26 September 2007 - 08:53 PM.

[batistuta]

KK, thanks for the links. I will go through them, in the same order.

[noflylist]

KK Guruji, if there is one book to read about Spirituality, which one would you possess. Let me rephrase, if you were on a deserted island with one book allowed...

[kullukid]

noflylist, on Sep 27 2007, 12:08 AM, said:

KK Guruji, if there is one book to read about Spirituality, which one would you possess. Let me rephrase, if you were on a deserted island with one book allowed...

Oh no look who's back from rehab!!!!      "KK Guruji" is this your sense of humor you mentioned???    
Now let me see.....if i was on a deserted island.......it would have to be "How to build an ark in 7 days" by Noah

Or "The Wisdom of the Overself" by Paul Brunton.

http://www.amazon.co...p;index=blended

http://www.mountainr...91157/31003.htm

http://www.tradition...us_brunton.html

http://www.angelfire...va/brunton.html

http://www.paulbrunton.org/

[batistuta]

KK, that is a very good list, that you have posted. After going through that in the same order, I know where to start ( Atleast I think I do, But Let's see!) . I can, Now, understand why you asked me to read it in the same order. The temptation to skip or view different chapters is too great.

Thanks,

Cheers.

Edited by batistuta, 30 September 2007 - 02:45 PM.

[kullukid]

Hi Bati, Here's another excellent link regarding "The Teachings of Sri Atmananda Krishna Menon" written by one of his disciples in the 1950s;
http://raghavendrakg...20Atmananda.pdf

Also; http://www.advaya.nl/
Om Shanti! KK

[kullukid]

Even more links on the life of Sri Atmananda Krishna Menon & His Teachings:

http://www.mountainr...91157/73715.htm

http://www.geocities...r_tvm/philo.htm

http://www.sunyapraj.../Atmananda.html

[batistuta]

kk, great links. I seem to have missed your  your previous post with the other links. Lots of reading to do!!

Thanks

Edited by batistuta, 21 February 2008 - 02:38 PM.

[kullukid]

batistuta, on Feb 21 2008, 09:07 AM, said:

kk, great links. I seem to have missed your  your previous post with the other links. Lots of reading to do!!

Thanks

Hurry up Bati! I think you missed these Ramanaji links too.   

http://www.gourmetin...p...ic=3266&hl=

[batistuta]

kullukid, on Feb 21 2008, 06:06 PM, said:

Hurry up Bati! I think you missed these Ramanaji links too.   

http://www.gourmetin...p...ic=3266&hl=

, yes. Will read this soon, kk

Best Wishes,

Edited by batistuta, 22 February 2008 - 08:00 PM.