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Doctors' Strike

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in colleges and universities across India, the central government is pushing a system whereby 50% of the seats available to potential students will be reserved for certain categories of people. among these special categories is people who are from 'neglected' and 'lower' castes and in some cases 'minorities' [muslims, christians etc]

the doctors are protesting against this action because they feel that this reduces the number of openings for the general category. the doctors were canned pretty well in Bombay couple of days ago while protesting..so thats added fuel to the fire.

the competition for these seats is tremendous. if a prestigious univerisity has 100 seats, then under the proposed scheme, 50 will go for this special categories. add to the another say 10 seats being for non-resident indians..you are left with 40. and how many students apply to such prestigious schools..30,000? maybe more and you have them fighting for forty positions!!! its atrocious in India to get into good med schools..absolutely atrocious for the 'general' category folks.

the census for these special categories was conducted in 1931. nobody has recategorized these special categories as some of the designated communites are pretty well off.. and there is no economic criteria as such... its petty politics and the intentions of the government are not genuine when they do this. absolutely no strategy to really uplift the weaker or affected sections. sigh! Edited by greenchutney

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I feel there is a need for reservation... BUT certainly not by the caste or minority status.

For example a fairly smart child from poor background would have to work, and fund his studies. Each day he may be getting 3-4 hours of time to prepare for an entrance exam as compared to his affluent competitor, who would be spending 12-14 hours of the day in special coaching classes and mock tests meant for preparing for these entrance exams. So how can we say that, the better off crowd with average brains and smarter off crowd with no means to study in similar lines, should be held at the same parity ???

However seat reservations based on caste/religion only helps in the dumb rich kids in these groups to get an easy chair into the colleges for they still go to the special coaching classes unlike their poorer cousins. This creates a sectional divide in colleges between merit students and reservation students, and for sure the reservation students end up much below the general class average in performance statistics.

I support reservation, but done in much a sensible manner with points for economic status of the students, historical academic performance, means of supporting studies and a much wider index of sorts arrived at by making fresh studies on the targeted audience.

If we can do exit polls to arrive at 3% variance in election results, it is very much possible to do sample surveys and use other statistical tools to get the data without doing a 100% census. All just depends on the mindset of those in power - a genuine feel to help out OR just vote bank politics ?????

I remember in days when I was studying hard for my engineering entrance test, this super rich kid came and asked to go out with him. I asked him, dont you wanna prepare and he said, "nay I will make it without preparing much! I am from backward class"!

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Another aspect of reservation is that you JUST CANT COMPROMISE WITH QUALITY. So there has to be some cut off %age that you should have before getting admitted in that college/office.

In my college, my class of 30 students have 8 seats in reserved category. The last candidate in genral category got 240/400 in the entrance exams and the topmost candidate in reserved category got 70/400, some even got admitted when they got 10 / 400. How do you trust your life, your house or any other profession they are joining with the incompetent people.

The need of the hour is "Affirmative action", which means that if there are two students with the same merit, you give preference to the student of the reserved category. but you cant neglect quality.

Reservation should be given in schools, not in higher and specialised courses and certainly not in jobs. Secondly, it should be done for economically weaker section which should have nothing to do with caste.

But I doubt that this will happen. The way politics work in India, reservation is the cow, whom everybody wants to milk. so I dont think any party will oppose this motion, in parliament.. and its gonna pass :rolleyes:

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[quote name='sudheer' post='4332' date='May 17 2006, 03:29 AM']I feel there is a need for reservation... BUT certainly not by the caste or minority status.

For example a fairly smart child from poor background would have to work, and fund his studies. Each day he may be getting 3-4 hours of time to prepare for an entrance exam as compared to his affluent competitor, who would be spending 12-14 hours of the day in special coaching classes and mock tests meant for preparing for these entrance exams. So how can we say that, the better off crowd with average brains and smarter off crowd with no means to study in similar lines, should be held at the same parity ???

However seat reservations based on caste/religion only helps in the dumb rich kids in these groups to get an easy chair into the colleges for they still go to the special coaching classes unlike their poorer cousins. This creates a sectional divide in colleges between merit students and reservation students, and for sure the reservation students end up much below the general class average in performance statistics.

I support reservation, but done in much a sensible manner with points for economic status of the students, historical academic performance, means of supporting studies and a much wider index of sorts arrived at by making fresh studies on the targeted audience.

If we can do exit polls to arrive at 3% variance in election results, it is very much possible to do sample surveys and use other statistical tools to get the data without doing a 100% census. All just depends on the mindset of those in power - a genuine feel to help out OR just vote bank politics ?????

I remember in days when I was studying hard for my engineering entrance test, this super rich kid came and asked to go out with him. I asked him, dont you wanna prepare and he said, "nay I will make it without preparing much! I am from backward class"![/quote]
agreed with sudhir
provide free coaching to them is also a option but no excuse in cutoffs

make them able to achive that target not provide them easy target to maintain the quality.

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those intereted can read my opinion on this link -

doctors on strike -

[url="http://o3.indiatimes.com/rediscoveringindia/archive/2006/05/15/679074.aspx"]http://o3.indiatimes.com/rediscoveringindi.../15/679074.aspx[/url]

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hi all,
I competed in the open general category and did both my UG and PG courses. I did my PG course in a Central Govt Institute. This was in the early 1990's soon after Mandal. The competition was horrendous. There were about 40 seats and more than 30,000 applicants. :D
My colleagues who got in thru the reserved quota were definitely 'different'. Though academically there were not so good, they were never made to feel inferior by the staff, faculty or colleagues. and some of these 'reserved' students are now in the US...(different controversy!!!) :D
So, there is no question in my mind about the need for reservation..[b][u]it is needed[/u][/b].

The questions we face are :angry:

1) AT WHAT STAGE IN LIFE ?
Does Schooling require reservation? does PreUniversity?. What about professional courses? What about post-graduation? What about at the job hunting stage?

2) Should reservation be used through out ones career ??
There are some who claim reservation at all these levels....Therein lies the crux of the problem.
To 'elevate' the oppressed they do not need help at every level. i.e. Emancipation does not occur at varous academic levels. An individual is emancipated or not.... he cannot be "emancipated" at the MBBS level and "backward" at the post graduate level....the idea is to [b]level[/b] the playing field not tilt it one way or the other...

3)How to tackle the problem of the "socially backward but economically forward - the so called -creamy layer" ??

4) Finally, why is no political party against this ??

The debate will be endless... and the answers lie in this debate... not in a lathi charge...discussion, debate, consensus should be the way...

regards, :D
choledochus

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I have some questions to the GOI chaps who brought up this reservations issue.

a) A hypothetical example; suppose Arjun Singh is going to get operated upon. Would he choose a doctor team from the 'general' categorty pass students or from the 'reserved' categoryt pass students. why? I want to know why he choose one or the other. If he says, it doesn't matter which team, I want to know why too.


b ) Is this reservation along with fee subsidy? I mean, getting to be a Doctor costs money, is the GOI planning to waive money/tuition fees for reserved group? Setting aside seats is one thing but allowing a scholarship? IMO, this reservation only makes sense WITH scholarship if it's supposed to do what it's doing. Then, it clearly becomes a case of economic discrimination as poor general category students gets a raw deal. Some people cannot afford the costs though they may qualify. The situation then is no different than a 'reserved' category student, a lack of opportunity.


c) what's the reason for the arbitrary 27% to 50%? Why not more like 99% or less like 2%? The rationale for choosing such numbers?

I'm all for reserving seats for the deserving, just who are the deserving and what criteria is used is the one I want to know.

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I've not read what is written above,' but even if I can afford quality accudation anywhere in the world, I do not supprt the this. I was part of anti-mandal movement when I was young and with Rajiv Goshwami when he died, I may be old now but I went to AIIMS and sponsored all the mineral water and lunch I could.
As 7 yar old daughter has been and is a equal human being and I do not trust Indian police inspite on my family being a 'royal' family' and talking so much openinly on th internet ( I did not know that they were tracking me all the time) Edited by vinayverma

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[quote name='Paagla Dashu' post='4454' date='May 17 2006, 10:44 AM']........If the criterion for determining who should have reserved seats in educational institutions and reserved jobs is "Economic Ability", then I, for one, will wholeheartedly support affirmative action.[/quote]

I am with you. what is happening right now is arm twisting by a certain section of the people by others who have vested interests.

a news report today shows the in-charge of the backward classes centre in new delhi expressing dismay at non availability of any type of authentic data on how the people who enjoy reservations have progressed over the last fifty years!!!!

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